Haggle much?
3With news on the upcoming Alibaba IPO (http://money.cnn.com/2014/04/21/investing/alibaba-ipo/) I couldn't help but reminisce about my trips to China and amazement at how much negotiation was woven into everyday life. From food to taxi cabs to socks, I witnessed price negotiation on just about every type of product or service. As an American I was blown away and quickly realized why Chinese business people had such a strong reputation for being shrewd negotiators. Negotiation was a part of growing up, not just a skill learned for a business purpose. Meanwhile I was used to walking into stores and paying what the business told me to pay like a good consumer.
Alibaba has haggling as an important part of their platform. Could Americans ever adopt this in ecommerce? 
As a semi-skilled negotiator I like consignment shops and car shopping. I think I'd like to try my hand at more negotiating for more goods.
Companies like Netotiate are banking on ecommerce haggling being adopted. Does anyone out there really want to haggle for the ecommerce goods they buy? Fun, annoying, compelling?.....what say you
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My mind went there too. One of my favorite scenes from the MP films
As someone who is really bad at haggling, this really struck me on my trip to China. I remember my translator/guide berating me for paying way too much for shot glasses because I didn't haggle enough. I think I ended up paying more than my friend spent on a pretty sweet replica sword.
For whatever reason (most likely residual social awkwardness from my teen years) I just don't like the process of haggling in person. I don't want to insult the person by offering too little and never seem to know when I'm paying too much.
That said, I'd be much more interested in haggling online as it would remove all of that perceived awkwardness and I could work on my negotiating chops.
We should play Civilization at some point. Trading makes good negotiation practice.
All you're offering is open borders and you want open borders and 200 gold? DENY.
I would think haggling online would be frustrating since you have to wait for someone to get back to you.
A trip to China is like a spiritual journey where you must discover your inner haggling chi.
@jont The first city my sister lived in there was a smaller city without many foreigners. She had to gain a reputation as a strong negotiator in order to not get taken advantage of regularly since she was easily identifiable. Had you been in that scenario I wonder what type of negotiator you would've become.
I guess I either would have been taken advantage of mercilessly until I ran out of money, or learned quickly. Probably the former.
I'm kind of split on this...I mean, haggling is good and all, as long as both parties are being reasonable.
Being "an old car guy", I (still) despise customers coming in with unrealistic expectations, and/or coming in and start playing games from the jump.
I actually find it hilarious whenever those people get mad, because I refuse to play their game...I'm like, "you're the one that came to me like that"! SMH some people...
It's nice to just walk in somewhere, pay the price, and move on. You want a better price? Shop around.
Because of a dude on Twitter, I always read "SMH" as "Smell My Hand" before I read it the right way. It was really funny in this case.
LMAO @katylava, that's awesome!
Let the market haggle!
@koreancowboy Imagine the crazy things that would be said during impersonal web negotiations. Stands to be entertaining as long as one isn't emotionally invested.
LOL this is true @denboy
Negotiating a car deal via email versus in person is a bit tricky...I just have to assume that the other person really means business. I
Haggling with one person isn't bad. It's useful, especially if you know enough to pick a fair price to settle on. I would consider a haggling style site; but think it would go best with only numbers.
Here's the item - X
Asking Price - Y
Offer - Z
Counter - Y2
Offer - Z2
Etc. - no personalities getting too far in the way.
I find it interesting that the older a culture is, the more they (seemingly) value haggling and politeness/hospitality.
What got me, when I went to Morocco, was the scale of haggling. That is, I always had a vague notion that if the initial offer was $X, it was likely I could try to get you down to somewhere between 50% and 75% of $X.
But really, if you're playing the game right, you should actually end up at 5-10% of $X. Which makes for some bizarre starting points:
Him "$10 for these 10 post cards."
Me "I'll give you $0.05."
Him "Ok, I can go down to $5."
Me "I'll give you $0.25."
Him "$1.50 is my final offer."
Me "Ok, fine, $0.50."
Him "Deal."
Wow. For anyone that doesn't understand that scale there's a steep price to pay
Yeah, with my haggling skills I would have paid at least $8 for those.
@jont I would have paid about $12
I would have taken the first counter.
I would have been insulted if someone offered me $0.05 when the starting price was $10.
@thumperchick Making it too structured to me takes the personality and creativity out of the haggling and would remove a lot of the fun. There are some entertaining communications and language that can happen in negotiations. It's also fun to try and read what is being said as compared to what reality is. Maybe that wouldn't come through in an ecommerce setting though?
Maybe there could be a choice for how to negotiate built in. A more structured version and the wild and crazy anything goes version.
I think it would be difficult to make that work in an online setting. But I would be curious to see how it played out.
I do not care to haggle regularly. I find it slightly discomfitting to subsidize the purchases of others because I value my time less and my serenity more than they do. But worse is when a seller takes that to mean I'm a complete sucker. My US Customs declaration forms usually have $0 declared because I just can't be bothered to take the time and effort to buy shit when I'm away... but put me in Disney World and the purchasing never ends.
However, I actually haggle quite a bit; just not a big back-n-forth like I envision when I think of haggling. Never do I buy something in person without asking for some sort of a discount. For example, in stores where I know they regularly run coupons, I'll ask for the going rate. I'd guess that a spare coupon gets scanned that way 60-80% of the time. I'll take that sort of success rate in exchange for the simplicity of never having to argue over what's covered by the coupon, never needing to search for a coupon, etc.
This reminded me of the 'Good Guy Discount' from This American Life:http://tinyurl.com/q2tdevy (Prologue) I could never do this.
Love the GGD. I'm trying this as often as I can stand it.
My spiel, "Hi, I'm working on this project. It's nickel-and-diming me to death. Any way you can soften the blow with a spare coupon?
@Thumperchick, I always had the sense that haggling benefits the person with the most information and experience. Not every time, but on average. Retailers in the US don't do it because it's uncommon and they can make up their front end information asymmetry losses (i.e., not haggling with buyer) in volume & efficiency of sales and by negotiating better deals on the back end (where they're the buyer).
No one is hiring me as a buyer anytime soon; free advice being priced at about its value and all that...
Did you haggle for that? Was the person at the register frustrated by asking for a discount because...?
@fgarriel If you go to a store that regularly has a coupon, but you don't have a coupon or even know if they are running one at the moment, just ask. I have never had a problem getting whatever coupon discount w/o having the coupon. You might say, gee I left mine at home or out in the car, do you have an extra one I can use.
I haggled {although I prefer the term "negotiated"} w/ the cable company recently.
I called and said I was going to switch to a satellite service, but thought I'd call before they showed to change me over { and I had scheduled it, but hadn't signed anything } and this is what they are pricing me at what can you do for me so that I stay. She came back w/ an offer and I said, well they also threw in x # of boxes and these other channels and it was for less. She said hold on. After a few minutes she said I had to talk to a supervisor and we can do xyz. They got to keep me as a customer.
I think it's becoming much more competitive in some markets and this works.
The sat. co was a little cheaper on the first year of a 2yr contract. But I don't really like those contracts w/ the high penalty clauses, and it would of been not fun having them in connecting things up. So it worked out about the same.
Next : time to tackle my phone services..
nice haggling. you have all the power when you're the one willing to walk away, good use of your leverage
I feel completely out of place when it comes to haggling. I'm sure if you were brought up with it it's not such a big deal but it's definitely not something I'm used to. But a big part of it is reading body language and so on. With online purchases it seems like it could be a long drawn out process.
It could be long but it could be really quick for take it or leave types of offers
I have a ton of items in the "Saved for Later" section of my Amazon shopping cart, some of which have been sitting there literally for years. I monitor the price changes on that stuff, and occasionally -- when something gets a big discount -- that'll be my impetus to buy it. I have often wished there was a feature that let me make an offer on those items, or even just indicate my willingness to purchase at whatever future date the price drops to or below some specific amount.
It'd be interesting in that any future price drops would start to be gradual. Drop it $1/minute to catch everyone at the most they'd spend.
They're like that anyway -- lots of up-and-down of a few cents. It's rare a drop (or spike) is very big, but common that I act on the biguns
@matthew I do the same thing with my saved items and that does seem like a good feature for Amazon to have, it's not like they're really losing out on money because I wouldn't buy the thing unless it hits that price.
I really like the idea of making an offer on products but I'd imagine I would have to be buying from a person rather than a business.
I save stuff in carts and wish lists on many sites for same purpose. I dislike places that auto empty carts after so many days.
eBay has a "make an offer" feature sellers can use. I have only accepted that invitation once or twice, and never has a successful transaction resulted.
I've done that as a buyer w/ success a couple few times. Guess I didn't buy from you.
This American Life episode prologue on haggling: http://tal.fm/515/0
No good guy discount available at Michael Kors designer bag store. You'd think that a $330 handbag would have some room for negotiation, but not this time.
maybe it's assumed that if you're shopping there you're probably not a good guy and deserve to pay the 300%+ markup
I also didn't act the part well enough. I think I was too aggressive (relatively speaking) in seeking a discount. The key is to be pathetic
pathetic guy discount more accurate?
When I asked, I was steered to other options. Insisting got me in front of the manager, who then did the same thing...
I taught my sister-in-law about the GGD when she ordered pizza for 20+ people. It got a chuckle... and free antipasto and garlic knots.
No GGD (according to me) at the best Italian restaurant on the East coast (according to Mario Batali), Vetri in good old Philadelphia, PA.
The waiter was even a fan of TAL.
Waiter chuckled, but was genuinely curious about it. I told him about the TAL episode and he changed the topic to Ira Glass's brother.
@MeatieOgre really enjoying the GGD updates. Keep them coming! I'd be interested in knowing more details about what they say and how they react.
I remember doing something similar at Kohls a while back and they scanned a %20 off coupon for me that expired the prior week that they had.
I did not truly learn the art of the haggle until I traveled to the far east expanses. There my eyes were opened to the great wisdom that items are worth only what I'm willing to pay for them, and not the price that is prescribed.
Shoes for $40? Nay, kind sir! For you see, I'm already wearing a fine set of podiatric adornments. Another pair would simply be a burden to my simple life, and is nary worth $5.
What's that? $20 you say! Well my friend, get a good look at my fine footwear as they demonstrate their superior ability of walking away from such outrageous monetary requests.
Surely you're now chasing me down to once again gaze upon my superior sneakers?
Oh? $15? I still believe this to be a purchase that is beneath my luxurious loafers! but I will indulge upon your offer - as you seem to be a fellow of high caliber.
real story with a real price you paid?....or did you walk away?
@denboy it's the same process that worked for me 80% of the time in China. Offer low, act like you don't need it, buy after walking away.
@denboy it's also fun to hang out in markets and see what they get away with charging to people who don't haggle. Easily quadruple.
^ I was/am one of those people.
My sister was living there so I really enjoyed watching her work...in mandarin of course
The thing I don't like about haggling is when i'm trying to sell something on one of those "listing" websites, I do research and place my item up for sale at what I believe (after doing research) to be a fair price for both the buyer and myself and now you want to come in and offer me 25% of my, what I believe to be fair, asking price ... why don't I just start throwing arbitrary numbers on anything I want to sell =/
since "fair price" is subjective, never start there. in China they start @10+ times fair, maybe time to ask for more to get what you want
people like to feel like they talked you down. paying asking price on a car lot is insane, same goes for all starting prices for a haggler
But the problem is, if you list an item too high, people just don't even bother contacting you.. Unless our views as a society change,
you shouldn't have to over price your items expecting to get haggled. Unless you know something is ridiculously priced, what you see should
be what you get. Maybe two prices should be listed: Take it or leave it $25.00 / Haggle price $150 :D
I guess what I'm really trying to say is I don't like low ballers, I have no problem negotiating within reason, just don't low ball me.
^^^ someone talked about good guy discount.. i've gone in to stores asking if they have any extra coupons or what not and have gotten deals
I'll give you $0.05 if you put all these replies into a comment.
I would gladly accept your $0.05 and consolidate everything.. except I don't see an option to delete comments except on recent posts =/
I can do it for you, but it'll cost you $0.05.
$0.05 is awfully steep, especially when you consider that you were the one wanting them consolidated first ;) I'll let you do it for free :)
Tell you what, if you make them into a comment I'll delete these replies and we'll call it even.
They would seem out of place as a comment.. How about just delete all my replies except the "low baller" reply and i'll be satisfied :D
Spending the better part of my life on the US-Mexico border has given me great haggling skills. But I didn't realize it also gave me good social skills at this sort of shopping till I went with a tour group to China and they were overwhelmed by the inexperienced and aggressive street vendors, mostly people who'd been displaced by the dam project and given tourist kitsch to pitch as their new vocation. They watched me make some great deals on things I wanted and turn away things I didn't want with a simple "No thanks" when even resorting to rude behavior didn't help them escape. I ended up teaching a haggling class several dinners in a row, "how to successfully (and politely) say no" was probably the most valuable (certainly for my own serenity, I felt badly being in such rude company), but I gave them lots of tips they put to good use.
you could probably make some extra cash doing web class on haggling
That would be nice. I still haven't really figured out how to monetize the web.
Professor of Haggling should be a University position with supporting curriculum. Would be more valuable in life than lots of other options.
Professor of Haggling sounds like something you would find at Hogwarts.